Talk:Henchman
I'm not really sure what to do about listing level breakdowns. All that information should be contained within the individual area locations; you'd hit, say, Nolani Academy page and it'd have a little notation: Henchmen Level: 6 (or whatever it is, I forget). It'd still probably be good to have a shorthand version of that on this page, but if we list every city, outpost, and mission JUST to list the level.. enh. Maybe add a link here to zome "master zone list" (do we have one floating around?) and on this page, have a broad level range list; Post-Ascalon henchmen are 3-6, N. Shiverpeaks are mostly 10-12, and so on. Nunix ---- Yeah, a location taxonomy style box would be useful, which could contain this sort of info. Might knock one up tomorrow and start playing about. LordBiro/Talk 11:12, 5 Jun 2005 (EST) ... cult of (dead) personalities. Sigh. Gravewit Henchman article content So, a couple of ground rules I think we should set (though remember that at this stage, everything's open for discussion): * Word things as "factual" as possible. Biggest instance of this is the "Alesia is not a good healer!" line that was in her article before. I think she's great. I've done every mission with her as only healer and have completed 'em all (with, at most, 1 other PC in the party). Even ran Villainy with her @L 16. So obviously people are going to to have pretty different experiences with the henchmen. * Add an image. I'm going to put up a few of these (took some screenies at Yak's Bend) but they're far from the best, and if you've got a better one, upload it (as maybe 1, 2, etc). Other things: * "Origin" is where you first meet them; I know you first meet Orion on a quest in Pre-Sear, and Thom's sitting there at Barradin's Estate. I don't know the origins of any of the others, but maybe someone else does? Be a good thing to fill out for trivia's sake. * Don't forget Category:Henchman and Category:NPC in the top of the article. Nunix ---- We may need to qualify some of the skills within each henchman section as they vary depending on level. Thom, the Cultist and the Enchanter keep getting dropped from the party as they change level so I suspect the changes may be significant between levels. Alesia uses Heal Other at level 15 or so, but I think not at lower levels. Dunham uses Aura of Restoration at the start, but switches to Fire Attunement again at about level 15.Fengol Hmm, I'd been wondering about that! Since these pages will remain pretty static, it's probably best to simply assemble as complete a list as possible, and then tighten up the presentation later; maybe add level range after each skill (i.e. Restore Life (L 3-20) or something similar) Nunix There is are skill listing for all the earlier henchmen in this article. Not sure what the general position is on using the information vs testing ourselves. --Dlanod 10:19, 5 Jul 2005 (EST) ---- I find the groupings extremely corny. :) "The Ascalon Four" the "other guy#1" :) I think we can break it down by party size. i.e. 4 member parties get to choose from: Orion, Reyna, Alesia and Stefan. 6 member parties get to chose from those plus Thom, Claude and Dunham. 8 member parties are 4 types: Temple of the ages has those same guys. Tomb of the Primeval kings has 4 generic henchmen. Dragon's lair to Thunderhead keep has Lina and then finally the Ring of Fire Islands have the Ascalon Heroes. What do you guys think? If I hear no complaints soon, I'll go about resorting it that way. --Karlos 15:24, 7 Jul 2005 (EST) Sounds good to me. I contributed to the chaos when adding in the later henchmen without fixing up the earlier groups. Also, the main page still refers to this as "the magnificent seven", back from when people didn't know/there wasn't anyone after Yak's Bend. --Dlanod 15:44, 7 Jul 2005 (EST) Resurrection Signet The article says that all henchmen have a Resurrection Signet on them. I'm pretty sure most of them do, but I know that Reyna does not. There have been many times where she is the only member left alive and it will begin a countdown until resurrection, because there is no other way for the rest of the party to respawn due to her not having a Res Signet. Does anyone else know if other henchmen don't have it as well? --Big Blue 04:53, 14 Sep 2005 (EST) :They all have a signet or restore life. The timer will start if there are only henchmen left alive with no way to resurrect (as in, they already used their signets). --Fyren 04:57, 14 Sep 2005 (EST) ::I can confirm she has it. Only problem is, she is excrutiatingly dumb in using it. In general, you may lose a res signet or two along the way and not notice. In the heat of battle, Alesia gets skewered by a Minotaur and Reyna resurrected her while no one is looking. But, the worst thing is, because she is fairly resilient with Troll Unguent, she will stand around, and then try to use her res sig on Alesia, res her, fight with her for 10 more seconds, then Alesia gets mauled again, then Reyna dies peacefully content that she just added more DP to Alesia whom she actually hates. :) --Karlos 17:07, 14 Sep 2005 (EST) :::Yes, I noticed that, too. But it's not only Reyna, they're all like this. When a Monk goes down and there is no one left alive in the party with regular means of resurrecting (i.e. a secondary monk player who has a res skill, too) any henchman will usually immediately use a res signet, no matter what the combat situation is. --Eightyfour-onesevenfive 17:15, 14 Sep 2005 (EST) ::::OK, I guess I'll just pay closer attention next time. Thanks for clearing it up, guys! --205.173.169.253 23:21, 14 Sep 2005 (EST) :::::I find it hard to believe that Reyna has ever used her sig, for anyone. I know she has it and that she's never used it because she's usually the only henchie left alive when I play. Once she's the only one left, there is no ressurection count-down and she just stands there, stepping on the corpses of whoever may be in my party until some patrolling mob picks her off. ::::::As mentioned, the henchies use their sigs quite fast, and in the middle of a fight. It's much more likely you didn't notice. Also, if you really were in a situation where Reyna was the only one alive and the timer didn't start, you should have taken a screenie and reported to Anet about it. It shouldn't happen. The timer always started when only henchies are alive for me. Unless maybe because you were in a mission? --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 19:51, 16 October 2006 (CDT) :::::::I'll take into note taking a screen cap next time (thanks, I just don't think about that sort of thing). But I assure you that it was not in a mission (I do missions either in PUGs or with guildies). Comment on Henchmen "Pro & Con" When talking about pro and con, my immediate impression is a comparison between different henchmen. For example, Alesia's pro is that she's a healer, because most other henchies don't heal. If I want to decide whether to pick Alesia over other henchies, I look at the pro and con of each henchman. On the other hand, some of the entries compare the pro and con against profession sterotypes or other factors. Example, Dunham is a mesmer, but does not interrupt/shutdown. I feel like this kind of issue should be in a different subsection, because if I decide to leave Dunham out of my group, based on that con, I'll be taking someone else who can't interrupt/shutdown either. I'm not saying ppl can't complain about Dunham not doing shutdown, but is there a logical way to put it in a different subsection? I hope I'm making sense. -PanSola 12:30, 18 October 2005 (EST) :I think telling players what to expect is a good thing. Frankly, this is semantics. Do you question that the info should be there? No. You just don't like it in the form of "pros" and "cons." I disagree. --Karlos 16:34, 18 October 2005 (EST) ::I believe we got two types of info mixed up in one single catagory. For pros, it's pretty much all comparisons between henchies, whereas for the cons, we got a mixed bag of inter-henchie comparison and individual deficiency as characters of respective professions. Yes, it is semantics, and in my humble opinion this is one of the case where semantics does make a helpful difference. I'm not asking stuff to be removed. I'm wondering if there's a way to distinguish comparisons among henchies from deficiencies of individual henchies, by creating a new category outside of "pros & cons". Both information are helpful to players, and I believe the helpfulness to players can be increased if two different types of evaluations are in two different sections. There are time when I want to know all the evils of watching TV. Othertimes I want to compare the good and bad of watching Television on my couch, playing GuildWars in front of my computer, drinking beer at a bar, or doing homework that was due an hour ago. Two types of evaluation, two lists. Useful semantics. -PanSola 21:34, 18 October 2005 (EST) :::I categorically disagree: :::#The example of the TV and the couch is not pertinent. Please explain the pertinence in terms of usability to the user or readability or something related to this wiki. :::#The content is not even big enough to warrant a division. :::#I frankly don't see your point altogether. It's not like the user reading that Devona is not as good defensively as Stefan yet at the same time she packs a powerful punch is going to be concerned and confused that one info was relative to Stefan and the other is not. I am really trying to see the need for us to change all those pages to some new format just because semantically, this note is made in reference to Cynn, while that note is made in reference to human players. :::#In contrast, I believe this is a list of "What can you do with him" and "What to watch out for (how he may fail you)." I am looking at it purely from a user's perspective. Especially a user who is new to the game who doesn't know Little Thom from Big Ben. I think they should be be told what the henchman does well, what he does poorly, what he can do and what he can't do. I only put the stereotypical stuff because that's what a "noob" would expect. That Claude can raise the dead and that Dunham can abuse spell-casters. :::--Karlos 21:59, 18 October 2005 (EST) Some Changes Cynn: Fire Ele Little Thom: Axe War :) --Melly 23:13, 21 October 2005 (EST) While Dunham was labeled as an "Enchanter" in the game, he has no enchantment skills whatsoever. A Hexing Mesmer might describe him better, since 2 out of 6 of his skills are hexes. -PanSola 02:45, 23 October 2005 (EST) :I would describe his as a useless mesmer, but it's not up to me. :) The game uses "Enchanter" in the same sense as "Enchanter's Armor" Enchanter here being one who enchants others, not necessarily one who casts "Guild Wars style enchantment spells." Loosely, enchantment as a word contains hexes. --Karlos 07:44, 23 October 2005 (EST) ::Which always makes me wonder if those "Enchantments last 20% longer" mods work on hex spells too (anyone actually knows the answer for sure?)... Anyways, it's still misleading. We can't do anyting about Anet's labeling, but since we aren't calling Little Thorn a "brawling warrior", might as well NOT call Dunham an "enchanting mesmer". Besides, the only things Dunham can do that would make him "one who enchants others", are his two hexes, nothing else... So I vote either just label him as a plain "mesmer", or a "hexing mesmer" to lower the possibility for confusion. -PanSola 10:30, 23 October 2005 (EST) I updated the section mentioning that the Zaishen henchmen were only available during the PVP Beta event as that's been and gone now and they're still here. Planescape@gmail.com Reyna/Dunham Res Signet Can anyone verify the recent anon edit about Reyna and Dunham's res signet? I would tend to discredit it as Dunham isn't available before Yak's Bend (which is where it says they start using it), but I can't say as to wheather Reyna might behave like this as I've never used her before at least Kryta (and she seems to me to be the first one to always use a res signet). --Rainith 22:37, 6 December 2005 (UTC) :It's just people being stupid. I don't know how this got to be such a popular myth. I've verified that all the henchmen have restore life or a signet. --Fyren 23:05, 6 December 2005 (UTC) Henchmen old names... I remember the whole "We are only going to reflect the state of the game now" deal. From that perspective, should all the notes about "Henchmen Blah used to be named Blah Bludder" be deleted? Or do they still serve some value of present relavence? -PanSola 01:10, 7 December 2005 (UTC) :Probably should be gotten rid of. --Rainith 01:21, 7 December 2005 (UTC) ranger descriptors Reyna and Aiden are simply listed as 'Ranger' while everyone else has their main skill line before their profession. Would it be fair to call them 'Marksmanship Ranger'? They don't use traps and they don't have animal companions. --Nunix 04:47, 11 January 2006 (UTC) :Arching Ranger? d-: ::I believe they are generic rangers. They're no exactly super archers either. --Karlos 05:33, 11 January 2006 (UTC) :::Weill their only attack is with the bow (with enhancing preparations), so I figure they'd be archers. -PanSola 05:38, 11 January 2006 (UTC) Death Penalty I heard that the henchmen do not suffer from DP although my own experience felt like they were getting squishier after falling several times. Any thoughts on where and how this rumor came to be? --Ishmaeel 02:14, 15 February 2006 (CST) :That must be a rumor. I can't say I have any sources to confirm this, but experience tell me that they must have DP. (Things like claude dying faster each time and such :P) --Markild 02:32, 3 March 2006 (CST) :This would probably be easy to confirm- cast something like Protective Spirit on them and measure it's effects before and afterwards. I wondered the same thing as well. 216.141.24.7 15:28, 27 March 2006 (CST) ::As long as we cannot see numbers above their heads, I don't see how Protective Spirit will be helpful in this case. I'm thinking of dipping them in poison swamp and timing their lifespans, but I cannot bring myself to it. Oh the cruelty! --Ishmaeel 16:07, 27 March 2006 (CST) :::Well, Orion casted one Fire Storm too many and I finally snapped. Took him to the swamps outside the ToA and soaked him in. He definitely has DP. At first he took almost a minute to snuff it. When he got to max DP, it didn't take him 20 seconds to kick the bucket. That'll teach him. --Ishmaeel 03:16, 28 March 2006 (CST) ::Do henchmen lose death penalty via normal combat? 76.204.89.239 04:51, 28 October 2007 (UTC) :::Yes (T/ ) 04:56, 28 October 2007 (UTC) Redundant Information At this point, almost everything in the section "The Henchman" appears redundant to what is shown in the following table "Henchman Availability". Is there any objection to simply adding notes to the table for the four Zaishen henchies, as well as the two special event groups; then eliminating the section "The Henchmen"? :Does no reply signify acceptance of the change, or lack of traffic to this talk page? If no one replies, I'll just make the change later today. I guess it can always be reverted back if someone objects. --161.88.x.x 01:32, 2 March 2006 (CST) ::A long enough period of no reply probably means it's ok to change. People will certainly speak up after that if they disagree(d). ;) --JoDiamonds 04:21, 3 March 2006 (CST) "Yes" and "No" templates are broken Well, I have no idea why they stopped working (perhaps it's just an IE issue?) At any rate, I made a change that removes the "style" text from the henchmen table so that the style actually affected the text, but the data still isn't showing in columns like it should. --Barek 22:54, 4 March 2006 (CST) :Fixed by Skuld --Barek 23:07, 4 March 2006 (CST) Henchmen Penalty I was playing with some people last night, and one of them told me that parties recieve a "penalty" for taking henchmen, in that the chance of recieving loot is disproportional to the number of people in the party. The example he gave was that if you were in a party with 7 henchmen then rather than having a 1 in 8 chance of getting a drop it was actually more like a 1 in 15 chance, I.E. every henchman counts as two people. I said that I didn't think that this was true, but someone else in our group (a guy who is generally right about these kind of things) said he thought this was the case as well. Does anyone have any information on this? 23:31, 10 March 2006 (CST) :I'll try some tests this weekend to actually quantify the drops. But I really don't think it makes a difference. You'll see fewer drops on the ground, but that's just because the henchie drops aren't visible. I've done most of the explorable areas with both henchies and with human groups, and my memory is that I came out of it with the same count of goodies as long as the overall party size was the same. --161.88.255.140 00:32, 11 March 2006 (CST) ::Yeah, that's what I thought 161.88.255.140, I think this would be something that's difficult to test. I mean, if you do end up getting less in a party of the same size with henchmen, you could just argue that you were unlucky. It would take a number of averages to show any conclusive evidence. I'm just thinking out loud really :) Any confirmation would be a help! 00:46, 11 March 2006 (CST) :::Hi Biro, long time no see! :) I've read that rumor, too, somewhere. To me it is just another rumor about drop rates. Hmm, maybe if I'm really bored some time soon, I'll see if I can prove it wrong. :) --Eightyfour-onesevenfive 02:15, 11 March 2006 (CST) ::::Lord Biro lives!! :) Good to see you around, sir. And to answer your question, I believe such a hypothesis is Charr Doodoo of the highest quality too. :) First of all, why would ANet do that? To discourage using henchmen? Because they know henchmen actually outperform human players 90% of the time? And second, it is not corroberated by any evidence. I can make a note of drops in a mission and get back to you on that, but I think it's overkill. I think the only difference (a slight one at that) is that henchmen won't leave drops behind that you can come around and pick up later, so it feels like you had more drops with people than henchmen because many players leave drops behind. --Karlos 07:36, 11 March 2006 (CST) :::::Ok, I just went out for a stroll with Alesia into the Black Curtain.. I was up 10-8 on drops when I got tired of doing it. I do two man farming a lot and the drop pattern with Alesia is the same, you get an item she gets one, you get two in a row, she gets two in a row soon after. No surprises. --Karlos 18:25, 11 March 2006 (CST) Resurrection and Factions Henchmen From the FPE, not all henchmen have just "resurrection signet" and "restore life", but the protection henchman had Rebirth, the Rit hench had Flesh Of My Flesh, and I think another one of the monk henchies had Resurrect. --64.229.218.70 12:15, 3 April 2006 (CDT) "siding" of Henchies in Factions I disagree with saying they "appeared to have sided with Luxon/Kurzicks", just like Togo and Mhenlo did not pick a different faction to "side with", so to speak. I believe they either have the greater good of Cantha in mind and went to one side or the other as envoys (and helping that side to gain their trust is just one of the steps required to bring the two sides together), or they are just mercenaries and do whatever the player wants. -PanSola 20:59, 27 April 2006 (CDT) :Your statement maybe true for the ones that come from the monastery like Talon and Zho, but for the ones who are of those two nations, that is true. For example, Danika. --Karlos 13:22, 29 April 2006 (CDT) ::I removed the siding information from eg. Danika, as you can't be any more on the side of the Kurzicks than being the gorram daughter of Count zu Heltzer. Unless you are a traitor to your faction, in which case a note would be warranted. (Danika isn't.) — Stabber ✍ 13:24, 29 April 2006 (CDT) ::Well, it's also ridiculous to say that "It appears that Danika has sided with the Kurzicks", because she IS a Kurzick. Ditto with Argo. -PanSola 14:56, 29 April 2006 (CDT) Henchmen banners should we include an image of the Henchman banner which seems to appear almost anywhere there are henchies in town, I first noticed the Canthan Henchie banner in Lutgardis Conservatory and then I traveled to Shing Jea Monastery and sure enough the same banner was there too. I know in Tyria they have a banner with proffesion icons on them, but this is the Canthan Banner: --Jamie 05:54, 26 May 2006 (CDT) Must split This article needs to be split into three articles, a general henchie article outlining what they are and how to add them, remove them and interact with them. And thena henchies (Prophecies) and henchies (Factions) pair of articles that lists available henchies by locale. Objections? Volunteers? --Karlos 05:14, 14 June 2006 (CDT) :No objections here, but not important for me either. I don't mind the way it is currently set up. -- Bishop rap| ] 05:30, 14 June 2006 (CDT) ::Is this the reason for the tag? If so, wouldn't it be more accurate to give it a tag? --161.88.255.140 16:23, 26 June 2006 (CDT) Henchmen are their own species.. I am beginning to believe that the in-game mechanics consider henchmen as their own species (maybe all NPCs/allies?). This is because of the situation with the Kurzick henchies fighting the Stone Scale Kirin. Whenever you fight them with those henchies (which include Wallows), you will see that disease will spread from Lukas The Smart to everyone (including Sheena and Brutus) but onto your player. A test with EoE would be good, but not between your character and Sheena, but between Sheena and, say, Lukas or Erys. Have one die in the presence of the other and see if EoE triggers. The problem of course is getting monsters to hit the one guy you want to be hit. :) While this might not have great rammifications on the game, I think it is noteworthy. --Karlos 15:52, 26 June 2006 (CDT) :I think we *should* actually test whenter EoE on a player affects Sheena and vice versa, though as an additional to the test you requested above. -User:PanSola (talk to the ) 06:42, 13 July 2006 (CDT) :Ok, human henchies do take damage from EoE when I kill myself. Shenna and Brutus don't take damage. -User:PanSola (talk to the ) 17:15, 18 July 2006 (CDT) Factions henchie grouping study Not 100% accurate. In the process of filling in what's missing and looking for all exceptions. Notes 1. Headmaster Vhang does not appear in Zen Daijun (location) because he is used as a Mission NPC for the corresponding mission. Additionally, instead of being in Vizunah Square (Local Quarter) with Togo and the other Shing Jea Instructors, he was at the Foreigh quarter meeting Mhenlo & Co. This is likely related to him being the only headmaster among the Shing Jea Instructor henchmen. 2. These henchmen are not available in Kaineng Center and The Marketplace, most likely due to the fact that they are used in the quest Welcome to Cantha which is right next two these two places. :What's this for? To identify exactly where all the henchies are located? Or just reformatting the table for a better representation? If the latter, I don't mind, although I see no need, since ppl rarely use that table anyway. If the former, then there's no need to check further. I checked when I updated that table and all the location pages. --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 19:56, 16 October 2006 (CDT) Side Notes on Henchmen There are some unique traits in some of the henchies' AI that I've noticed that are not marked anywhere on the henchmen page. Some, I admit, are on their individual pages, but I would like to see a quick overview of the different henchies' 'quirks'. Some that I've noticed are: *Casters always get into the heat of battle instead of staying at a safe range. *Dunham spams Distortion. *Monk henchmen secretly wish they were Warriors. *Lina casts prots indiscriminately. *Healers heal indiscriminately. *Stefan and Thom do not follow their set roles (Stefan and Thom are Fighter and Brawler henchmen respectively meaning 1v1 dealing more damage and Brawler meaning 1vMany dealing less damage. Part of this is more of a programing issue deals less damage and has more defense, while Thom should have those traits, but instead of using their builds to their advantage they just attack whoever the Hell the want to) *Neither Stefan or Thom use Sprint, even when they're falling behind. *Claude spams Blood Ritual needlessly, most often near the point of suicide. *Alesia has an alleged 'love affair' with Dunham, as she will not resurrect anyone so long as he is dead. I've also noticed that she also prolongs her time with him before returning to the group (she will stand on his body for a few seconds before she resurrects him, and after she uses rez she uses Healing Touch on him and stands next to him for a few more seconds). *While Alesia is pretending to be a tank, she will often run to the opposite side of a mob's aggro bubble before attacking. *Orion only casts Fire Storm when and where it is most useless (ie: at the end of battle or on a mob that's on the move). *Reyna will attack any mob within her aggro radius instead of following you through it (which conflicts with what it says in the article about henchies always following you). Although she is a master with Troll Unguent and will likely survive the mob, by the time she decides to follow you, "shortest distance" logic kicks in and she will likely pass through many more mobs on her way to you. —''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' 24.89.253.231 ( ) }. :Although some of your observation are true, some are not. I've been playing the game with henchmen only (+ my girl friend) from the beginning and when you learn how you can counter the bad sides of the hench AI by acting correctly. Here are some of my thoughts and corrections. :*Claude indeed spams BR, but that's why I use him. It's very nice to get BR once in a while, thou I can't understand why he sometimes uses it on my warrior too. :*Stefan and Thom don't use Sprint as they don't have it, but I agree with you. They should use "Charge!" as they both have it. :*All of the healer henchies res the dead party members in the same order. Dunham is not the first one to be ressed. They start with players and henchmen with permanent res skills and then move on to others. Usually the necro hench is the first of the non-permares henchmen that is resurected for me, but it depends on the res sig status of the dead henchmen. :*The healer henchmen always take a short break before and after ressing someone, not just with Dunham. I suppose they are regaining energy. :*Orion's Fire Strom can be easily controlled with some experience. Ofcourse his firestorm will be late if the whole mob is wiped out early, but with tougher mobs you should learn how long it takes for him to start casting Fire Storm from the beginning of the battle. When you think he is going to cast it really soon, call a fresh target who will not die instantly and he will cast the Fire Storm on the new target, making the spell useful. :*Reyna is not the only hench attacking mobs when you try to run through. :I don't think that the specifics belong to this page and I am pretty sure (didn't check thou) that all of the generic hench things are in the article. -- (talk) 03:46, 18 October 2006 (CDT) ::*Claude uses BR on ANYONE who has less than 25% max energy IIRC. The AI somehow knows your current energy and will react accordingly. ::*All henchmen will step into half spell range or closer (whichever is more offensively efficient) so that you can kite, but they don't have the AI to kite effectively themselves. ::*Warrior henchmen attack whoever you are attacking. If you are not attacking, the AI will determine whoever is most dangerous, and they will attack in the defense of others. ::*Dunham generally dies first, as since he has hexes, will be the priority target of all mobs. ::*In regards to Reyna, you stopped, even for just a second, because if you keep moving and the henchmen have room to move, they will follow you. ::*Dunham always spams Distortion for some odd reason. Even when there are no enemies about. ::*Monk henchies always cast based on priority. Whoever needs it, gets it. Unfortunately, Alesia's main healing spell is Heal Other until she gains Word of Healing (and with no energy management or condition/hex removal...). ::*Everything else was pretty much stated by Gem. 220.233.103.77 04:35, 18 October 2006 (CDT) :::Guessed you saved the page faster than I did :P The other things that I had not already mentioned: :::*If you target the enemy backlines, all your henchies will charge ahead into enemy melee range just so they get in range to your target. You need to control your targetting to keep your own casters in the backline. :::*The healers charging up ahead is usually becos they needed to heal someone up front. They don't bother to move back after they're in front. :::*Stefan and Thom do use Sprint, but only in the lower levels as they start an attack. Sprint gets replaced by Charge later one, and Charge is something they don't use often unfortunately. Not sure where you got the definitions of Fighter vs. Brawler, but I always thought of them as defense vs. offense. :::I'll add some of the relevant points into the individual pages. --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 04:56, 18 October 2006 (CDT) ::::*embarassed* I didn't know they have sprint earlier on. Woops. -- (talk) 16:13, 18 October 2006 (CDT) :::::I hate to sound snooty, but I wouldn't have mentioned those things if I hadn't experienced them. These things happen every time I play with henchmen, and apparently a few of them have also happened to other players. Should I report it? ::::::I know you don't want to sound snooty. I think I can understand your complaints regarding henchmen, which is similarly to what ppl post about them in forums. Do check out the external link that's provided. It contains a helpful guide on how to control the henchmen using called targets. --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 19:29, 19 October 2006 (CDT) Ok, allow me to recap what you said and why none of it is worth mentioning here in the wiki: #They always get into wanding/casting range. You can't expect them not to attack with their weapons. This is by design, like it or not. They will also kite if under heavy damage. #Yes, Dunham does spam distortion. It's listed on his skills. It's his defensive skill. #Umm, that's more of a cynical comment. However, Alesia's page does mention that flaw. #Define indiscriminately. #Define indiscriminately. #These roles were defined by you. They really have the same role, which is to attack called target or whomever you are presently attacking. #They use Sprint to charge into battle to guarantee aggro. It's actually a nice tool if you know how to use it. Call a target just outside your aggro bubble, then stop, do not attack. They will rush in and start attacking and succeed in holding aggro most of the time. #Claude does not spam Blood Ritual, he uses it when an ally's energy drops below 10 energy. His biggest flaw is he uses it on warriors, namely Thom, whose entire energy pool is like 20. #Alesia gets confused on res often, it has nothing to do with Dunham. Her "cons" lists her glaring res issues. #Alesia likes to stay close to YOU. This poses a problem for melee classes as you'll often find her running next to you as you rush into mobs. #Orion's nuking problems are well documented. #Most henchmen AI (not just Reyna) is such that if there is a mob amidst their group, they will keep attacking it sporadically if you have called another target. You will always notice it when there's a melee foe hacking away at them and you called another target, when you switch back to the melee foe, you'll found he lost health and has hexes and stuff on him. They changed their "follow you 100% of the time" sometimes back in January or so. They do cast and attack your target, but somehow they land a few hits on the nearest melee attacker to them too. This only applies to melee foes as far as I have seen it. If you have three enemy casters and you target the furthest, they will not attack the nearest at all. Overall, most of these flaws are documented and some are not flaws but simply you having a different expectation. --Karlos 16:16, 19 October 2006 (CDT) *After one of the updates, all henchies with active resurrect signet will use it in unison as soon as a party member eats dust —''The preceding unsigned comment was added by'' 60.48.99.184 ( ) }. ::Umm... they've been doing that for quite a long time. Also, this discussion is half a year old. You might want to start a new section. --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 20:35, 14 May 2007 (CDT) Directing movement while the sole human player is dead I added some info to the directing movement section about their behavior when the sole human player (who is, of course, the party leader) directs them using the main flag. I haven't had an opportunity to test out their behavior when more than one human player is present. I just have one story to work with: My corpse was in the middle of a huge group of enemies, I didn't have a shot at being resurrected so I directed the henchmen to follow my main flag far away from danger. I followed with the camera by selecting one of their names in the Party window. I tried directing them towards another zone but as soon as they crossed the "swirly" thing, they immediately got teleported back to my corpse, forcing me to direct them out of danger, again. So yeah, does anyone have more information on how this mechanic works? and how it works with more than one human player present? (e.g., what if two human players are dead... do the henchman, upon attempting to exit the zone, teleport to only the party leader's corpse?) --Spread 05:41, 13 December 2006 (CST) :You being dead has no effect on anything. Heroes always follow the player whos heroes they are, unless that player disconnects, in which case they act as henchmen. Henchmen always follow the main flag of the party leader. -- (talk) 09:32, 13 December 2006 (CST) ::Oh that I know. I probably wasn't clear; I was merely suggesting adding some information on henchmen's behavior when they are directed towards a different zone. Perhaps elaborating on what I added and putting in anything else I might not have included. Was hoping to elicit some more info on this (directing henchmen, party leader dead or not). --Spread 06:59, 14 December 2006 (CST) :::Henchman will teleport to you when they cross the portal, regardless of whther you're dead or alive. Basically henchies cant go through the portal, only human players can. --IcyShaker 04:54, 20 March 2007 (CDT) Nightfall Henchmen I wonder if they made them suck on purpose so that you would be forced to use heroes. Some don't even get elites or that many skills.--Cursed Condemner 12:29, 25 March 2007 (CDT) :They all have elites when on level 20. (except the dervish) -- (talk) 13:58, 25 March 2007 (CDT)' ::You forgot Aidan, he doesnt have an elite in Nightfall.- ''Leader Rat'' 14:02, 25 March 2007 (CDT) Hard Mode Edits With the new Hard Mode, do you think we'll need to edit the page to describe the buffed up henchies?Abhorsen 21:31, 20 April 2007 (CDT) :Yes. --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 21:36, 21 April 2007 (CDT) Move note I support the move suggestion and turning around the redirect. I haven't found a specific policy about singular/plural in the article name at a cursory glance, but since it seems to be de facto convention, I'd vote for keeping it singular where possible. -- Roland of Gilead (talk) 06:15, 30 April 2007 (CDT) they're following me If you get to far from where you planted the flag, does weird stuff happen? I plant a flag, run really far, and suddenly one of them is right next to me and the rest are running to me and the flag isn't there. Is that normal? On a side note... I do seem to get a few more drops when they behave and stay away from me. I'll continute investigating — [[User:JediRogue|'JediRogue']] 18:28, 1 June 2007 (CDT) New Henchies in GWEN WOW... i was really impressed with anet for have good henchies!... Cynn used meteor shower now, monks have a good rez and better elites, warriors dont use Charge! anymore. Great job Anet Ssj2TrunksB 21:12, 2 September 2007 (CDT) :Yea, you can see other people saying more or less the same thing on most of the henchie talk pages. But on the other hand, I kinda miss Charge! when I'm backtracking an explorable area ;D --Ab.Er.Rant (msg Aberrant80) 03:58, 3 September 2007 (CDT) ::Haha, i know what u mean, but i would sacrifice it for stronger hechies 70.62.174.194 12:03, 3 September 2007 (CDT) Character Death and Flags About when you flag your henchmen and run off by yourself, I found that if you die and cancel the flag (to bring the healer for a resurrection, for example) the henchmen will follow the path you ran. I just tested this again, to make sure that it wasn't changed in a patch, and it happened again, maybe because of pathing or something? Anyways, here's a link to the image that shows the path I ran in Sunqua Vale: PathOnean 19:31, 12 September 2007 (CDT) Caster Hench Wand Just a quick question, what kind of wand do all the caster henchmen use? I've noticed its the same one for all of them, regardless of their different classes. Is it even a wand that a human can get? VegaObscura 15:54, 17 November 2007 (UTC) Boss Soloing Can you use Henchmen to clear the Path to a Boss and then direct them outside compass range so you have no loot penality? Didn't find any info regarding that in the article. -- 01:39, 16 February 2008 (UTC) Subst Hench templates? Is there any reason not to substitute the Henchmen (region) onto this page? These region pages are orphaned anyway, and it's not as if they're using any template. If Templates are used for readability, then a template should be made for the EotN henchies. mendel 14:34, 1 June 2008 (UTC) :This was done because the page was getting really long and editing anything was getting pretty hard. Now it's easy to edit either these lists or the rest of the article separately without having to scrol through hundreds of lines of text. I agree with splitting the EotN henches to their own page in a similiar manner as the others are. -- (gem / talk) 16:38, 1 June 2008 (UTC) ::Thank you, I'm going to do that as time permits. mendel 17:01, 1 June 2008 (UTC) Agressive Stance The main problem i find with prophecies henchies is that they are selfless, claude spamming BR til death, alesia standing being pummeled while using res, altho as it is these problems can't be solved or if changed cause controversy, but what really annoys me is that they are set on the equivelant of aggressive stance, leading monks to prioritise killing over healing dying team mates, casters using spells while under backfire(while alesia is trying to beat something to death, Little Thom or stefan over aggroing. In factions henchies are shamefully weak in builds and intelligence Talon has to be the weakest warrior ever, rit hench are pointless, assassins have about as much self preservation skills as a chronically depressed lemming (Red Dwarf FTW) and Nightfall i also find that its been overfixed, casters running away when hit and over aggroing, although threat priority has been fixed for melee/rangers/para in NF (they attack high dmg eles or monks which is nice). Now we come to EoTn and my what a difference Cynn is a maniac (a good thing for fire mage), Zho is wonderful, Talon is tankmaster, Devona insane KD'er Mhenlo and Lina can actually heal and prot well and the others perform admirabley. Bug? It's like this. I'm getting ready for a fight (using preparations and stuff) and for some strange reason, all of my melee henchmen run off to the mob I'm about to fight...even though they're about 1.5x aggro away. I hadn't even selected one yet, let alone call target/attack. Is this a bug, or did ANet make it so that henchmen can tell when you're about to fight (i.e. preparation usage) and so will run off to start fighting? This was a pain when I was getting Grandmaster Cartographer >< Basically, I want to kill Devona. She's always the one who runs out. "I'm Devona. I have a big hammer and a huge aggro circle. I'll make it harder for you to explore, so bring me along!" I've also seen Gehraz (Nightfall derv hench) do this.-Kaos Mastr 04:29, 21 August 2008 (UTC) :Yes, H/H AI has been having issues lately, big aggro range for no reason. And it's not just Devona or Talon, amazingly --Gimmethegepgun 04:32, 21 August 2008 (UTC) ::My heroes never do it unless I have them on Attack mode....which is only when I first get them and I forget to change to guard. -sigh- And in updates I thought it said that they fixed it like 2 weeks ago or something...must've imagined it.-Kaos Mastr 04:39, 21 August 2008 (UTC) :::It's not uncommon for Anet to fix a bug in one update, then unwittingly revert the fix in a future update. That's probably what happened here. —Dr Ishmael 04:53, 21 August 2008 (UTC) ::::I'm just wondering when it will be fixed. It's been a source of near-wipes. Good thing I always carry rebirth. And while they're at it...they should revert Melandru's Shot....I'm not going to waste an elite slot for a hunter's shot knock-off <.< Good thing I got Nightfall and can use Prepared Shot now.-Kaos Mastr 05:16, 21 August 2008 (UTC) :::::Well, supposedly this update fixed it --Gimmethegepgun 05:07, 22 August 2008 (UTC) I want aggressive frontliners! I do a lot of hero/hench vanquishing, and often times the difference between a cake walk and a frustrating run is whether or not you have a phys hero (dervish/warrior/sin). Switch him to aggressive, stand half an aggro circle away and call the frontliner as your target, and you've got a good aggro. Henchmen (Thom and Stefan is all I've tried so far), however, do not aggro in this way, meaning that aggro is split up. You often have to ride the edge of the circle to get them to run out and assault, and the smarter HM enemies skips right on by the tank to take turns making each of the lower-armored casters drop like drunken flies. I know A-Net doesn't read this wiki, but can anyone point me to the right page to bitch on? — Powersurge360 07:33, 11 September 2008 (UTC) Mini Skill Bars Should we add mini skill bars to these tables? --◄mendel► 03:42, 17 November 2008 (UTC) :Yes...however IMO the page needs a redesign. (good info is obscured by presentation, too much space dedicated to the profs tables, ...) I have some ideas...and (as w/other items), I'll put together something in my user space that ppl can critique. — Tennessee Ernie Ford (TEF) 05:16, 15 March 2009 (UTC) Henchmen Skillbar Update The big reference table needs several corrections now thanks to the big skillbar update of late '09. More fixes than I can do right off the bat, anyway.--Alessar 01:18, February 17, 2010 (UTC)